Hunchman801 wrote:I have to agree here, none of my factual points has been addressed and now we're ending the debate. Though maybe that's for the better.
Oh, the classic internet "Yeah, we should stop this discussion...... I won, but let's end the discussion".
Amazing bait, I guess I'll take a bite. I really didn't want to go deep into this because it literally takes an entire day to get 1 or 2 responses regarding this "racism" topic, and there are many more things I want to talk about in Rayman Adventures. If there was a way to chat with you or keep things in a fast pace, it would be easier for us to get into an agreement.
First thing to note: Only some of your points where factual
, and I didn't address them because they were right. I'm not gonna defend a wrong stance, even if it's mine. I know that's part of human arrogance, looking like fucking assholes because what they say first should be the definitive thing, but I prefer to mold my opinion into something that I feel is right. That's why I gave you the reason when you said that the word I was looking for wasn't racism, but stereotype instead.
But things departed into what should be considered opinions, and that's where I wanted things to stop. You where like
"I see nothing wrong here"
And well, I agree with you. In fact, I've always agreed with you. I don't believe people at Ubiart ever wanted to make a rude depiction of the japanese. They did it because old cartoons depicted the japanese like that and I'm sure they wanted to keep that "Classic" feel. I don't mind black people with big lips/afros in cartoons, chinese people with closed eyes, and it kinda pisses me off that current media wants to take cartoons and pretend like there's no alcohol or cigarettes in real life. Heck, I don't find this racist, and in the beginning of the discussion I made my point clear: I'm not a social justice warrior. I never felt offended or triggered by this, but if you read carefully my first post, I never said "these enemies are racist", I asked if anyone in this forum felt they were a little bit racist to them, and naturally, some people agreed with me.
What actually worries me a lot (and it seems you're not looking at the bigger picture) is that if Rayman Adventures was more popular (Because according to the survey they made, it seems like the game is a total failure), You'd see ton of articles talking shit about how insensitive the artists of this game are. I wouldn't want my Rayman to get into controversial waters, because the franchise is already dying. Heck, Nintendo had to change the hand in Mario Maker to avoid bad press. Now you'd say "Everyone in 2016 wants to be offended by something" but in the world of Rayman that can be easily avoided because they could get as far of humanity as they wanted. Rayman is fantasy, Rayman is surreal. Robots are Robots, Toads are Toads, Birds are Birds, and I felt it was completely ignorant to state that the Mariachis were racist, because unlike the Swordsmen, Mariachis are an actual depiction of how mexicans express themselves in their art:
Another detail is that Rayman's Mariachis don't wear sombreros or have the classic macho moustache. They have the exact same moustache that Hunter has, and a top hat, making them look more like members of a funerary house.
I think there's still no problem if the enemies were still Ninjas or shoguns in Rayman Adventures. Because that's still part of their culture. Heck, I would be incredibly impressed if they went for something like this:
But instead, I see they didn't do artistic research, and ignorantly decided to go for this:
And stapled Bruce Lee to the formula, which in reality is the only thing that pisses me off because I don't want forced pop culture in Rayman games
Yeah, that's the second thing to note, I don't hate these enemies because they're supposedly racist, I hate them because they're just there for a pop culture joke. I was kinda mad already when Ubisoft used 20000 lums under the sea to quietly advertise Splinter Cell. But at least they sort of blend well with the spy theme, so I can get through it.
But they chose the gorgeous ancient china to make enemies that wear the stripes that Bruce Lee pioneered.
And that later turned into the signature image of Kill Bill
That's too much for me. I find it distracting and kind of unoriginal. I don't feel confortable with Rayman parodying stuff that strongly. And that's my only concern. Sorry for booning (
) at you Hunch, it's just that it kind of pissed me off that you would only notice that at this point of the discussion when I strongly suggested many times that that was my only personal concern. You seriously were thinking that I was personaly racist-shaming Rayman, when I actually wanted to protect the series from that, and that seriously made me want to stop the discussion and say "eh. opinions". I also wanted to express how underwhelmed I felt with the amount of levels since the last two days, but I couldn't because this discussion was on the way for the entire week. I was tired. Sometimes I leave discussions and let things die because I'm not interested in it anymore. That's how I roll.
Medieval Mayhem then certainly represents medieval Europe. And, if the main enemies of the former represent its people, then the disgusting and dumb Lividstones represent Europeans. I feel deeply offended now.
If the world represents medieval Europe, the Lividstones wouldn't represent Europeans, but medieval europeans instead, you dummy.
As you might have noticed, the Lividstones no longer have moustaches in Rayman Legends, and they lack of higiene in this game can be easily associated to the Black Death, one of the strongest and most devastating pandemics in history, and mostly represented in the medieval era. The appearance of rats in the game strongly suggests this situation. In Rayman Origins, their lack of higiene seems to be more related by the fact that, you know, they're zombies now, since they needed to be associated to the livid dead in some way.